I’d just like to rant that the law does everything it can to protect tenants, as it should, but when a bad tenant knows how to play the system, the landlord can be down 6+ months rent before the courts get to evict them. At the same time this tenant (a builder) has casual employees who are paid in cash living in the flat and he takes the rent out of their income even though he isn’t paying the rent. Because he owns the bed and microwave in the flat he can claim to still be living there. This is effectively robbery supported by the law. This tenant’s bank account showed a monthly income of £8-10k. Meanwhile we wait for a court date…
4 Likes
tell the taxman names and situation of cash in hand . Stitch him up !! Get even. They will be on the social follow the jobs . Tell the job centre . Stitch them all up and get even
5 Likes
oh that’s going to happen…
2 Likes
8 to10k per month x12 will take him over the VAT threshold so the VAT man will be interested if he is not VAT registered That will be quite a hit.
2 Likes
Great! Thank you Colin3!
Whilst is Colin3 is right, and VAT fraud is very serious, you are actually overlooking a much more serious issue.
who are paid in cash living in the flat and he takes the rent out of their income
If he is organizing their labor, he is a a gangmaster. I think you might find it interesting to talk to the GLAA. Contact details - Licensing - Press office - FOI - GLAA
This could actually be modern-day slavery.
(If it’s not, go for the tax thing - but slavery generally trumps tax-avoidance)
EDIT: Advice for landlords can be found here
3 Likes
Nigel 1 That is a very good point. it possibly could be modern day slavery.
Do things like take a note of all car reg plates . The jobs they are working on, if you can. All this detective work takes up your time though. , Speak to neighbours also, A favourable neighbour can give a lot of info maybe even keep a log for you ? If they are being paid a good wage and not ripped off with "rent"it will not be slavery… More likely,they are claiming benefit and working . I say this because I do deliveries to small sites and can spot these guys almost at once… Just because they are paid cash does not mean underhanded tho… I do not accept bank transfers or credit cards in my insulation business. but I always give a receipt
1 Like
They could be trafficked people. Report, report, report. You haven’t got anything to lose.
Andrea6 wrong heading?
1 Like
name is Colin …This heading is the "tenant robbing the landlord Do nt you need “Landlord robbing the tenant” ? or similar . Create your own heading .
1 Like
The leap to “modern slavery” may sound over-dramatic, but as the government advice I posted a link to says, “not very thing that is like this is slavery, but every case of slavery looks like this”.
The fact he is not employing them through a company, but is deducting money from their earnings is a very bad sign. Very bad indeed. Unless he has a license for being a gangmaster, that is almost certainly a serious crime. It is hard to imagine a licensed gangmaster failing to pay rent.
Call the Modern Slavery Helpline on 08000 121 700 or fill out an online form. Contact the Gangmasters and Labour Abuse Authority to report concerns about the mistreatement of workers on 0800 432 0804, or by email intelligence@gla.gov.uk.
Bear in mind.
Slavery => max sentence of 18 years
Unlicensed gangmaster => max sentence of 10 years
VAT fraud => max sentence of 7 years
I would be cautious about making your own inquiries. Someone who might be looking at an 18 year sentence might turn dangerous with no/little warning.
1 Like
You can report your tenant anonymously using Crimestoppers, and I know for a fact the police accept information from them. That way you avoid becoming a witness in a criminal trial. They don’t deal with benefits fraud, but as regards the modern slavery and tax/vat avoidance, etc it is a criminal offence, so they will deal with it. https://crimestoppers-uk.org/give-information/forms/give-information-anonymously
1 Like
We can all agree on one thing.
The landlord & tenants rights’ law must be equitable and more balanced.
To do this, we need a government the understands both sides.
Without being political, but we can agree, this governments does not understand this.
We Landlords have a long way to go!
3 Likes
Marion Good idea . I had forgotten that I had done the same . But they did tell me it takes 3 weeks for the police to check their website !!
1 Like
I’m guessing he is sub letting then also? The law is a joke when it comes to landlords and completely unfair and it’s destroying so many law abiding tenants lives, not making it better! It only serves the thieves and fraudsters. However I thought landlords could serve a section 8 (which I believe has gone back to 2 wks notice) if a tenant was over 2 months in arrears?
1 Like
We have served a section 8 but nothing compels them to leave until the court date. We are sure they will up and leave the day before the court date, whenever that will be - we still don’t have a court date!. So far he has had 6 months free rent plus the income from his sub-letting workers - so he has had a tax-free income of about £7k on top of saving himself £7k. Mortgage payments made by us - well over £7k. Looks like robbery to me but there is nothing (legal) we can do.
2 Likes
We have served a section 8 but nothing compels them to leave until the court date.
I’m not sure you are seeing the bigger picture here. There are strict rules about deducting pay. He must have an agreement in writing before the deduction is made. Those deductions must be declared to the taxman, as they are a benefit, and tax is due on them. So one of three things has occurred.
- He has issued pay slips which have paid tax on a benefit not received.
- He has not declared the benefit at all.
- He is not officially employing them at all.
All three of these possibilities are tax fraud. The fact the employees obviously feel they are not in a position to recover the money for themselves, this indicates a sort of “coercion” is at work. Using coercive means to financially benefit from a third party is (modern) slavery.
Stop thinking like a landlord, and think like a citizen for a second, you have a legal and moral duty to report this situation. Not for your sake, but for the sake of others.
To quote the official guidance…
If you are concerned about the welfare of a tenant or tenants, or believe that something untoward may be taking place at your property, you should not challenge tenants yourself.If you believe a person is in immediate danger, you should call 999. Otherwise, if you have suspicions, this should be reported to the Modern Slavery Helpline on 08000 121 700. A false alarm is better than no alarm. The National Landlords Association advice line can provide housing specific advice to their members on 020 3870 3777
2 Likes
It’s absolutely disgusting that these people can’t be prosecuted for theft because he obviously has the means! This is blatant criminal behaviour yet just because he’s a tenant he’s allowed to carry on stealing! God I hope you do report hun to the tax/vat people. Did he send you his bank statements on line? Or do you still have a copy of them because he can’t get out of it with the tax/VAT if it’s there in black and white and I would definitely take it to court when you go for the eviction as it would be interesting to see what the judge thinks.
I’d also start a claim now with the small claims court so he can be served at your address saves tracking him down after the fact. I really hope you get the results you deserve because even though I’m a tenant and not a landlord I think the way the law is fixated on making sure the tenant always comes out top only works for the criminals and in turn the good tenants lose out because the trust is just not there and it definitely needs changing! Again good luck and I’d live to see a post from you telling us that karma has done her thing and he’s getting what the kind of accommodation suitable and free and is the perfect HMO he favours and a rent that’s perfect too as it’s feee room and board at HMP hahaha
2 Likes
If you haven’t already done it then I doubt it will happen, its such an obvious thing to do and your responsibility as a citizen that if you were going to have done this you would have done so by now.